On a Catholic forum I have been debating on, they just won't quit with the idea that Atheism means a positive claim that there are no gods. What do you think of their argument:
Phooney:They are related in their common usage, it is true. However, even your dictionary hints at their meanings in wider applications.
As _A_ has already pointed out, Atheist merely means without belief in a god, due to the "A" in front of "theist", which negates the "theist" part of the word.
You'll notice that Agnostic also has an "A" in front of it, this time negating "Gnostic", which is derived from some old word(s) regarding knowledge.
Here's what this means for all of us today:
Agnostic Atheist: "I have no knowledge of a God, and I don't believe in a God"
Gnostic Atheist: "I know there is no God"
Agnostic Theist: "I have no knowledge of a God, but I believe in a God anyway"
Gnostic Theist: "I know there is a God"
So, just recapping "atheism" and "theism" are 2 different ranges on a scale of belief, "agnosticism" and "gnosticism" are two different ranges on a scale of knowledge.
The A- prefix in Greek means None or Not, in a sense contingent on the Greek understanding of binary logic. Acosmicism means "no universe," not "lack of a belief about the universe"; Agnosticism means "denying knowledge," not "lacking an opinion about knowledge". Atheism, then, is "No-God-ism", the position that there is no God, not, "not being a God-ist-ism". Sanskrit, which is closer to Greek than Latin is and has the same prefix, has words like "Advaita", which means "not dualist," not "lack of a belief about dualism", and "Anatman" which means "no soul," not "lack of a belief about souls".
What many self-described atheists think is irrelevant; they're using the word wrong.
Of course it's not surprising to me that people whose philosophy is a bad retread of the Lucretian Atomists ("Nothing exists but particles and space," in modern terms), and the Epicureans, don't know any Greek. If they did they might have noticed Socrates and Aristotle refuted their cosmology 2400 years ago.
"Nontheist" means what you think Atheist means.
phooney: Despite how much more you might like to argue against those who positively affirm that there are no gods, all atheism implies is a lack of belief in gods, because all theism implies is a belief in at least one god. The "A" prefix in itself has nothing to do with belief.
A few examples of my own, if you please. Apathy (which I think you originally used, but I see have edited, perhaps because you saw this coming) lack of emotions, not the belief that there are no emotions. Asymmetry, a lack of symmetry, not the belief that there is no such thing as symmetry. Bald, a lack of hair, not a hair colour. Not collecting stamps, a lack of a hobby, etc.
Agnosticism, not "lacking an opinion about knowledge" and by no far stretch of your imagination "denying knowledge" simply the assertion that they, at least, and others perhaps, lack knowledge, with some, admittedly, denying the existence of knowledge by saying it is unknowable. The one thing that all agnostics have in common from those that just don't know, to those that say it is impossible to know, is the lack of knowledge.
Likewise with Atheism, some say there is no god, the rest of us simply lack a belief in any gods. The one catch-all that all have is a lack of belief in gods. Those that make a positive claim are called "strong atheists"
Socrates and Aristotle, while I give them plenty of credit for their brilliance with the available information, are hardly cutting-edge cosmologists. You might be surprised to learn that there have been advancements in the last 2400 years.
As far as I know, I'd say non-theist sounds pretty much synonymous.
Hastrman:Okay. But none of your examples is an ism, is it? See, we have that ism ending for a reason. It means, a system of thought. And yes, I did change it to make them all isms, not "because I saw it coming"--but because I wanted to make my explanation clear.
The way Isms have to be formed is, root-word plus Ism.
The root word of Atheism is Theos: God, not Theism, belief in God. A-theos means no-God. The ism formed off that, is "No-God-ism," the system based on the statement "there is no God."
On the other hand, a non-Theist is a person who is, pure and simple, not a Theist, not in the system of God-ism. No ambiguity--no tying yourself up with jerks like Richard Dawkins. Nobody has much dislike for non-Theists, other than a vague dislike that always goes with staying neutral, but what you call "strong" Atheists...almost nobody doesn't dislike them.
And no, we've regressed hugely from Aristotle in terms of metaphysics, albeit not in cosmology if narrowly understood as a field in physics.
Comments much appreciated!